Comments on: gmail vs pine http://snarfed.org Ryan Barrett's blog Fri, 18 May 2012 05:50:35 +0000 hourly 1 By: Jamesm http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-92617 Jamesm Thu, 22 Mar 2012 22:23:00 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-92617 <p>Did they release another update to the way google ranks websites? Ive noticed over the past few days some websites seem to bounce from ranks one to page two etc. This high rate of fluctuation makes me wonder what bases determine a websites's rankings and whether changes in the results are determined by changes made in Google's system or within the websites itself. If I had to guess, I believe this determination is based on a combination of changes both within Google and persistent tweaking of a website that could keep it balanced somewhere on page one.</p> Did they release another update to the way google ranks websites? Ive noticed over the past few days some websites seem to bounce from ranks one to page two etc. This high rate of fluctuation makes me wonder what bases determine a websites’s rankings and whether changes in the results are determined by changes made in Google’s system or within the websites itself. If I had to guess, I believe this determination is based on a combination of changes both within Google and persistent tweaking of a website that could keep it balanced somewhere on page one.

]]> By: ldillon http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-70059 ldillon Fri, 16 Dec 2011 20:49:58 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-70059 <p>Pine + Procmail is more powerful that any web UI I've ever seen (or probably ever will).</p> <p>The biggest shortcoming I see with every web-based email programs in general is that there's no way to add things like GnuPG. I think the body of ALL email should be encrypted by default. Sure, Gmail has SSL in the form of HTTPS but that's a long way from end-to-end encryption.</p> <p>(Actually I'd like to see the NIC hardware do encryption by default, but that's another discussion....)</p> Pine + Procmail is more powerful that any web UI I’ve ever seen (or probably ever will).

The biggest shortcoming I see with every web-based email programs in general is that there’s no way to add things like GnuPG. I think the body of ALL email should be encrypted by default. Sure, Gmail has SSL in the form of HTTPS but that’s a long way from end-to-end encryption.

(Actually I’d like to see the NIC hardware do encryption by default, but that’s another discussion….)

]]> By: Ryan http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-524 Ryan Wed, 06 Dec 2006 20:08:47 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-524 <p>pine will help you set it up. just run <code>pine</code> from the command line. also, <a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=pine linux tutorial" rel="nofollow">google is your friend</a>!</p> pine will help you set it up. just run pine from the command line. also, google is your friend!

]]> By: ryan http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-493 ryan Tue, 21 Mar 2006 22:33:15 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-493 <p>hi michael! i agree, i hate this too. it's not at all clear whether it's pine's fault or gmail's, though.</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>my first guess would be that gmail isn't formatting line endings as specified in <span class="nobr"><a href="http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2822.txt" rel="nofollow">RFC 2822</a></span>. maybe they're leaving line feeds or carriage returns out. either way, i'd bet someone on the <span class="nobr"><a href="http://www.washington.edu/pine/pine-info/" rel="nofollow">pine-info list</a></span> would know!</p> hi michael! i agree, i hate this too. it’s not at all clear whether it’s pine’s fault or gmail’s, though.

my first guess would be that gmail isn’t formatting line endings as specified in RFC 2822. maybe they’re leaving line feeds or carriage returns out. either way, i’d bet someone on the pine-info list would know!

]]> By: paulproteus http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-489 paulproteus Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-489 <p>If you add labels support to PINE, that would rock. Similarly, what is the best/fastest way you have found to view conversations/threads in PINE?</p> <ul class="minus"> <ul class="minus"> <li>Asheesh.</li> </ul></ul> If you add labels support to PINE, that would rock. Similarly, what is the best/fastest way you have found to view conversations/threads in PINE?

  • Asheesh.
]]> By: ryan http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-490 ryan Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-490 <p>hmm. i never really found a need to apply multiple labels to emails, so folders work just as well for me. i don't have any plans to add label support to pine.</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>you're right about threads, though. pine doesn't handle them nearly as well as gmail. gmail's big win there is the way it treats threads as a single entity, specifically in conversation view (which kicks ass), and applying user actions to whole threads by default.</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>pine has sort by thread - $ H in an index page - but it's rudimentary, and dog slow. eduardo chappa's <span class="nobr"><a href="http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/info/fancy.html" rel="nofollow">fancy thread patch</a></span> is better, and can apply user actions to whole threads, but there's no "conversation view" patch. to be truly competitive, threading support would need to be built in from the ground up.</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>still, <span class="nobr"><a href="http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine" rel="nofollow">nancy mcgough</a></span> or <span class="nobr"><a href="http://www.zrox.net/Mail/Pine/" rel="nofollow">gopi sundaram</a></span> might have something i missed. let me know if you find anything!</p> hmm. i never really found a need to apply multiple labels to emails, so folders work just as well for me. i don’t have any plans to add label support to pine.

you’re right about threads, though. pine doesn’t handle them nearly as well as gmail. gmail’s big win there is the way it treats threads as a single entity, specifically in conversation view (which kicks ass), and applying user actions to whole threads by default.

pine has sort by thread – $ H in an index page – but it’s rudimentary, and dog slow. eduardo chappa’s fancy thread patch is better, and can apply user actions to whole threads, but there’s no “conversation view” patch. to be truly competitive, threading support would need to be built in from the ground up.

still, nancy mcgough or gopi sundaram might have something i missed. let me know if you find anything!

]]> By: ryan http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-491 ryan Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-491 <p>check out Pine's keywords. they work pretty much the same as tags or Gmail's labels. (M)ain, (S)etup, (C)onfiguration, and add them to the keywords option. then you can set them on messages individually with (*) Flag, in aggregate, and with filters.</p> check out Pine’s keywords. they work pretty much the same as tags or Gmail’s labels. (M)ain, (S)etup, (C)onfiguration, and add them to the keywords option. then you can set them on messages individually with (*) Flag, in aggregate, and with filters.

]]> By: Guest http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-492 Guest Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-492 <p>Great post. I'm a fellow PINE junkie who is similarly pestered to "get with the program" and use a "real" mail client.</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>I do want to ask you a technical question. Do you know why PINE doesn't quote replies to gmail messages correctly and how to fix this? It seems it may have to do with the fact that Gmail base64 encodes their messages. For example, here is a simple message from a gmailer, as it's displayed in PINE (the following is NOT a real mailing address):</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <hr class="line"/> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2006 19:01:10 -0800</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>From: A Friend <xxxxxxxx@gmail.com></p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>To: Michael <msa@xxxxx.com></p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>Subject: Address</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>101 N. Kingsley Dr.</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>Los Angeles, CA 90000</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>A Friend</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <hr class="line"/> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>and here is how PINE quotes it in a reply</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <hr class="line"/> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>On Sat, 11 Mar 2006, A Friend wrote:</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>> 101 N. Kingsley Dr.</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>Los Angeles, CA 90000</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>A Friend</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <hr class="line"/> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>Only the first line is indented with a '>'. The rest are not.</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>This is a very annoying "feature" of PINE. Any thoughts?</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p><i class="italic">- Michael</i></p> Great post. I’m a fellow PINE junkie who is similarly pestered to “get with the program” and use a “real” mail client.

I do want to ask you a technical question. Do you know why PINE doesn’t quote replies to gmail messages correctly and how to fix this? It seems it may have to do with the fact that Gmail base64 encodes their messages. For example, here is a simple message from a gmailer, as it’s displayed in PINE (the following is NOT a real mailing address):

Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2006 19:01:10 -0800

From: A Friend <xxxxxxxx@gmail.com>

To: Michael <msa@xxxxx.com>

Subject: Address

101 N. Kingsley Dr.

Los Angeles, CA 90000

A Friend

and here is how PINE quotes it in a reply

On Sat, 11 Mar 2006, A Friend wrote:

> 101 N. Kingsley Dr.

Los Angeles, CA 90000

A Friend

Only the first line is indented with a ‘>’. The rest are not.

This is a very annoying “feature” of PINE. Any thoughts?

- Michael

]]> By: Guest http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-494 Guest Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-494 <p>News Flash!</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p>Eduardo Chappa of pine-info fame has made progress on the "replying to GMail" issue. We don't have a definitive solution yet, but as a workaround if you put a "." in your display-filters variable the problem should go away. Try it!</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p><i class="italic">- Michael</i></p> News Flash!

Eduardo Chappa of pine-info fame has made progress on the “replying to GMail” issue. We don’t have a definitive solution yet, but as a workaround if you put a “.” in your display-filters variable the problem should go away. Try it!

- Michael

]]> By: Guest http://snarfed.org/gmail_vs_pine#comment-495 Guest Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 http://snarfed.org/wordpress/gmail_vs_pine#comment-495 <p>Eduardo Chappa has posted a patch to Pine which fixes the "replying to GMail" issue. Check it out:</p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p><span class="nobr"><a href="http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/info/prefixbug.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/info/prefixbug.html</a></span></p> <p class="paragraph"/> <p><i class="italic">- Michael</i></p> Eduardo Chappa has posted a patch to Pine which fixes the “replying to GMail” issue. Check it out:

http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/info/prefixbug.html

- Michael

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